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3R Regenerator

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(joined October 2015)
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Hi,
Could anyone explain The significance of 3R Regenerator ? Whether it has benefit of using instead of NRZ/RZ and PBRS with BER analyzer.
Is it any difference in results of Min. BER and Q-factor and other parameters on using 3R Regenerator instead of PBRS in combination with Electrical pulse generator keeping all parameter same?

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Responses (38):

    • #32614
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      Ranjeet Kumar
      Participant

      Hi,
      Could anyone explain The significance of 3R Regenerator ? Whether it has benefit of using instead of NRZ/RZ and PBRS with BER analyzer.
      Is it any difference in results of Min. BER and Q-factor and other parameters on using 3R Regenerator instead of PBRS in combination with Electrical pulse generator keeping all parameter same?

      Attachments:
    • #32625
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      ZULKARNAIN
      Participant

      hi ranjeet…
      as already discussed by Damian in one of the previous post, the purpose of the 3R Regenerator is to simplify the connections in a design. Normally you would need the original bit sequence and generated electrical signal along with the output transmitted signal to generate a realistic eye diagram. This component removes the need to make multiple forks and connections from the input. However, sometimes it can fail for very noisy systems or in some other cases where the global bit rate does not match the received bit rate. In these cases I generally use the input signals for the Eye Diagram Visualizer.

      Protocol implementation using Optiwave


      with regards

    • #32626
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      ZULKARNAIN
      Participant

      So we use a 3R generator mostly for simplification of the layout. As for as its advantage is concerned regarding BER, the Min. BER using a 3R Generator was much higher than that without a 3R Generator, e.g., 10^-5 as against 10^-8 respectively.
      Hope this may help you.
      with regards

      +1
    • #32630
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      Ranjeet Kumar
      Participant

      Thank you ZULKARNAIN,
      I am not pretty sure about the things you are explaining is wright or wrong, But i appreciate your efforts to explain the problems.
      I will try to implement your suggestions in design and will see what is correct.

    • #32631
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      Ranjeet Kumar
      Participant

      ZULKARNAIN,
      As you have said that mostly we can’t use 3R Regenerator for noisy system because it gives more BER value than than system with PBRS and NRZ/RZ , I don’t know why it happens as it should give less BER because it uses default values of parameters.

    • #32638

      Hi ranjeet

      If you use a combination of PBRS and pulse generator in place of 3R regenerator,i don’t think there should be a strong variation in the values of BER and quality factor.Significance of using 3R regenerator is simply to reduce the system complexity.
      Still to verify the same you can simulate your system using both the cases and compare the performance.

      Regards

      +8
    • #32652
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      Ranjeet Kumar
      Participant

      Hi FAYIQA NAQSHBANDI ma’m
      There is some difference between results which depends upon type of system for both cases as ZULKARNAIN have also said. We will not get same results in both cases.
      Here i am uploading resuts of same system with or without 3R regenerator: Left side Image – with 3R regenerator , Right side Image – without 3R regenerator for OFDM system with 4 user.
      Here we can see a large difference between Q-factor in both cases for same system.

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    • #32654
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      Ranjeet Kumar
      Participant

      hi,
      I am uploading Osd file of OFDM system of which results has been considered on 2nd user.
      we can see the difference in results.

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      +1
    • #32666
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      Aabid Baba
      Participant

      Hello ranjeet,
      Zulkarnain is right when mentioning that the purpose of the 3R Regenerator is to simplify the connections in a design. Usually , we need the original bit sequence and generated electrical signal along with the output transmitted signal to generate an eye diagram.
      However, BER using a 3R Generator is much higher than that without a 3R Generator as far as i am concerned.

      regards

    • #32691

      Hi ranjeet

      In the images you have attached.The output of the case whr 3R regenerator is used is better than the other one.
      Did you check the different parameters you are using in the other case.I don’t still think there should be a strong variation in the results provided the parameters are properly defined.

      Regards

      +3
      • #32709
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        Aabid Baba
        Participant

        Hello fayiqa,
        Thanks for the reply. Well there is a difference. If you visit the link posted by zulkarnain you will find that there the person has implemented it and found results varying but you can be right in your case too. It is matter of implementation in different scenarios.
        Regards

        • #32756

          HI AABID
          It was a presumption based reply because what we actually do is just use 3R Regenerator Regenerator to simplify our system design by reducing the number of connections in a design….The performance should not vary to this extent because either way we are logically same and to our ease we use 3R regenerator instead of all three connections to be connected to the analyzer.. proper analysis is required in this case.
          thanks

    • #32726
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      Naazira Badar
      Participant

      Hi all..

      I’m surprised how results get bad in the case of employing the 3R Generator. That’s because I believed we make use of it to recover the original data and hence a reference signal is provided by it. In this regard, 3R Generator should always help in improving the results. I might have to check my results without employing it as well.

      Regards.

      +2
      • #32758

        HI Naazira
        I am myself surprised to see such a huge difference in the results which in my opinion should not be the case because either way we are logically same and to our ease we use 3R regenerator instead of all three connections to be connected to the analyzer..As i said it needs proper analysis.. I strongly believe that there should not be such a huge variation in the results.
        Thanks and regards

    • #32738

      Hi All

      Well Naazira thats really a fact that 3R regenerator as the name suggests is for improving and not meant to degrade the signal. I have myself used it many a times and found to function like regeneting the siganl and hence improving it.

      Regards

      Burhan

      +8
      • #32761

        HELLO BURHAN
        You are right it should logically regenerate the original signal in its true form and the results should get improved. However i am surprised to see such a huge variation in various system performance parameters as suggested by the screenhots posted by Ranjeet. I don’t think it should happen. Have you ever compared the results that you got by using both the methods..?
        Thanks and regards

        +1
    • #32780
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      Aabid Baba
      Participant

      Hi everyone,
      Well i feel it is a worthy topic to discuss. I too find it very strange that the results to such an extent. I could see quality factor to be varying very much.
      I hope someone analyzes it on his/her system design and compares the results by using/not using 3R Regenerator.
      Regards

    • #32791
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      Naazira Badar
      Participant

      Hi Fayiqa, Aabid and Burhan..

      Yes, I genuinely believe proper analysis is needed to be done before concluding that 3R Generator degrades the performance, as its only point is to help detect the original signal as accurately as possible.

      Regards.

    • #32798

      Hi All

      Yeah thats what we expect a regenerator to do.
      Fayiqa and Aabid i have not really compared the results but always used it with an intention to improve the signal and get a better improved signal to be analysed further.

      Regards

      Burhan

      +2
      • #32877

        HI BURHAN
        I agree with you. Indeed it should do it but i don’t understand what’s the logic behind all this.
        Thanks and regards

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